Joining me on the show today is Jamika Martin, Founder of Rosen Skincare.
Named a World Changing Idea by Fast Company, Renewal Mill is an award-winning, next-generation ingredient company that fights climate change and global food loss by upcycling byproducts from food manufacturing into premium ingredients and products.
In this episode you’ll learn how Caroline’s been driving growth through LinkedIn as her primary channel, innovative ways to get startup capital and specific slack channels anyone in the food industry should join.
Please note, this transcript has been copy pasted without the lovely touch of a human editor. Please expect some typos!
Speaker2: Yeah, for sure. So I'm Jamika. I'm the founder of Rosen Skincare. Simply put, roses just really working to create the next generation of Masami Care. Really, our goal is to kind of make that mass like I'll just a cleaner, more enjoyable place to shop.
Speaker1: Mm. Totally love the more enjoyable bit there. I have actually already read this, so I know the story. But for anyone listening or tuning in at the moment, could you tell us the story behind your brand name.
Speaker2: Yeah. So my middle name is Rose, so that's where a lot of it comes from. Honestly, when I first started Rosen or Rose Gold Cosmetics and like my LLC is still under that name just because I always wanted to kind of keep the name. But pretty early on, this is like super early when I was like thinking about, like what this was going to be, it was really clear that there was just like didn't fit the vibe, didn't fit like the aesthetic that I wanted. Also, just like a lot of people thought it would be makeup. And so just like super confusing. And so I actually did a class in undergrad where we were able to work on the business was like, hey, I'm working on this right now. Like Westerners do is for the project. And fortunately, everybody signed on because I like working with business for like the whole quarter. And so we kind of like brainstormed a bunch of other names. And I think we ended up doing a Google form and one of them was Rosann, which actually originally came from like Brose Natural's Shorten. But I thought the Rosann was just a lot cleaner, super minimal, and then also was able to fit into a unisex kind of like branding and yeah, just like super simple and effective and able to be used in a lot of different realms. And so that's kind of like where the name came from.
Speaker1: I love it. I always think it's so interesting to understand the reasoning for the name and it's something that I actually have never asked before. So today's the day that I'm starting that OK? I always love to start at the beginning. Rewinding A couple of years back, where does your entrepreneurial journey start?
Speaker2: I feel like doing something entrepreneurial. I mean, in a full fledged way. Of course. Rosen That's kind of the first thing. But I mean, before that, I've always been fairly entrepreneurial. And I think after I started Rosann, I kind of realized that me and my cousin would try to make jewelry or try to make t shirts or all these different things. And like middle school, I have found a notebook from like fifth grade where I had all these pencil pouches or like those gummy things you would put on pencils. And I would sell them to people who are very early on, kind of like had that path. And both of my parents, they were like more like service-based, like landscaping, house cleaning, stuff like that. But they were kind of like obviously very entrepreneurial as well. So I think that's probably where a lot of that came from. None of it really obviously ever panned out. I think I had like a lot of ideas before I started Rosann, even in college. But for some reason I always, like, wanted somebody to cosign the do let's do it. And for whatever reason, I didn't do that with Rosen and I just kind of like the open and got started. But I've always had just a ton of ideas and thought it would be cool to do stuff, but more so from like a side hustle perspective and kind of just like shifted my focus with Rose and ended up diving in full force.
Speaker1: What was it that started getting you thinking about acne? Why the skin care industry?
Speaker2: Yeah, and I think this kind of is probably part of the reason why I ended up long-playing on my own and just kind of like going for it. But I have such close ties to the Acme space just because my own personal journey with breakouts, I've dealt with that once again for most of my life, pretty much breaking out fifth or sixth grade. Did all the dermatologist's, did all the citizens, pretty much all the treatments I did like ran the gamut of whatever they say is going to help freakouts. I tried it and I ended up doing Accutane twice, just like superintends prescription drug, trying to get kids clear skin and most steamworks most of time you don't to do it twice and very few times. Is it like you do it twice and you're still kind of dealing with it. And so that was kind of the space I was in. And really the key point of inspiration of like, let's do something about this, because of course they had all these ties to acne, but it wasn't like, I want to start something here. But I think it was after that second round of Accutane. I was in college and I just remember kind of like, all right, my skin is breaking out again.
Speaker2: Let me go to Target and go to the army I like. That's where I shopped, where I could afford and where I knew. There's a lot of stuff for breakout breakouts like MySpace and pretty much seeing the exact same brand. So I shop since like 6th grade, like the same the same packaging, same formulas. And at the time, I mean, of course, we've seen so much go on in between now and then. But at the time there definitely was a lot going on within the beauty space and that was something I was personally interested in. And so I just remember being like, wow, there's literally so many cool brands out here. There's so much like whether it's branding or ingredients or all the stuff going on and there's nothing happening in the space. And like, I don't know, it just like made me feel like super bad about myself and my skin and also just like very inspired. It's like, why isn't there anything going on in this space? And that's what triggered this start to. Yeah, let's get working on this and let's try to tackle this industry.
Speaker1: Wow. And what year are we talking here to get some perspective?
Speaker2: Yeah. So when I kind of had that initial discovery that was like twenty sixteen. So I was a second year in college and basically I was set on that idea and play around with it. Think about it a little bit before like launching in twenty seventeen, which is what I ended up graduating college.
Speaker1: And to clarify, you didn't really have any background in skin care, right? You hadn't made or formulated products. You had no sort of formal training. You just got started.
Speaker2: Exactly. Yeah. My major was business economics, which is basically like how the economy works. Plus like two accounting classes. So it wasn't really like business, but UCLA did it in entrepreneurship minor while I was there. So that definitely helped with just the idea of starting a business. And it was at that point like I had this idea and then I didn't end up doing the mineable. I took some courses in entrepreneurship, I think like two or three, and then I ended up graduating. So I had like a little bit of a baseline there, but I didn't have cosmetic experience, obviously had a lot of experience on the consumer side of what I wanted to see and what my experience was. But as far as formulation and production and that was all stuff that I kind of just learned on my own, whether it's independent coursework or just like a lot of trial and error and just like continuing to do more research around it and figuring it out on my own.
Speaker1: Wow. Amazing. And I'm wondering what the people in your life around you were saying about this when you were kind of planting the seed like, oh, I'm going to start this business?
Speaker2: Yeah, I've been very fortunate, especially like my immediate family, my parents. I have been fairly independent even since when I was younger. So it was kind of like we trust you because like decision making. So go ahead and do whatever you want. I think the only thing that I would say was like, I don't even know if I want to say like negative or not fully supportive is like, oh, you should do this or you should go to a doctor or go get your MBA or things like that. And it's like, no, well, I'm doing something right now, splashier. I'm trying to figure it out. And so it was just kind of like not taken super seriously early on, which I think is totally understandable. And I think whether my immediate family or other folks as well, I had pretty much always done good in school. I graduated college early. Like I feel like there's a lot of trust in my decision making to me because a smart person like she's going to figure it out. And so I think I was very fortunate because I talked to people all the time. It's like, how did you convince your parents? Like, I graduated college and I was like barely making any money, trying to figure out how to pay rent. And so it was, of course, not what I expected when I graduated. And I have a lot of people who like how did you try to get them to understand? And like, I didn't really have to try to get them to understand. Everybody was pretty much supportive and trusted my judgment there. Nobody thought it was going to be like, this is such a good idea. This is going to take off. Like, I don't think anybody thought that by any means. But there's a cool that's cool. You're doing that like nobody really cared that much. And then, of course, as it grows, everybody's really excited and invested in the growth. But I didn't have a ton of pushback, which I think I was definitely fortunate for totally.
Speaker1: And I imagine that kind of confidence from other people in you really lifts your own confidence as well, because there is no people questioning you or being like, oh, are you sure? It's a nice bit of a boost. I guess you could say.
Speaker2: Yeah, for sure. I think that I definitely always had that for my family or from people who are close to me. And then I think I don't know, I've just always felt like very powerful and very competent, like able to make those decisions. It's just been a product of just like how I was raised.
Speaker1: Amazing. So what were the key steps for you in getting started and building the brand?
Speaker2: Yeah, so super early on, I will say, look, that time before I graduated with just me, like, what's going on? What am I doing? What is this idea? I think the key things that kind of came in after I launched, I say launch just kind of like when I went into a full time, but I didn't have any customers or anything like that. But I think the key steps there for me early on focusing on marketing and stuff like that, I think I tried to do all the things. And then I was like, you know what? I'm going to focus on Instagram. I got to focus on influencers on Instagram. And having that focus allowed me to just get a little bit more dialed in with, like returns. And what is marketing look like and what makes sense? That was definitely a crucial step for me. I remember early on doing a lot of things and I have a tendency to like, think things through and through and through, like I know it's fact. And then it's like when I say it out loud, I'm like, oh yeah, that's a good point. Like that I should do more that there's just this time. And I was sitting with a mentor right after I graduated and she's like, OK, so like you have five customers, like where did they come from? Like, you know, we keep getting traffic from YouTube. But I had sent a friend like a package and she did a YouTube video on it like months ago.
Speaker2: And then she's like, OK, so keep doing that. And I'm like, oh yeah, that's a good idea. So that was very crucial for me to just like really focus in and understand where you're coming from and replicate that. And then I think the next thing was I spent a lot of time trying to figure out our brand and who we were. And of course, it's iterated so much from the early stages. But I ended up working with the consultant early on on that, which is very hard for me because, like, I have a lot of money. But it was just like that was such a reassuring experience because I felt like I continue to run circles around, like this is who we are. This is what we do. This is who I serve. But like, I couldn't ever say it very succinctly and I couldn't clearly articulate it to people. And so once I worked at that person, I felt like everything was like very clear like this, who we are. This is what we do and this is who we serve is easier to have those conversations. And I just felt like when as the brand continued to get tightened up, it was just easier to reach more people and kind of expand from there. And so I would say those are the core areas that really impacted our growth. And our trajectory was just focusing on marketing and understanding who we were as a brand. Mm.
Speaker1: That's so interesting. When you say you worked with this consultant, what kind of consultant is that. Is that like a brand consultant. Oh yes. And how did you find that person. How did you even know what to look for.
Speaker2: No, I think I mean I'm very fortunate. It kind of like fell into my lap. So I wrote when I graduated, I did a summer accelerator, started this program. I obviously and they have lots of resources and they also have a summer accelerator. At the end of that, we did a pitch and this woman came up and those kind of like I do branding and consulting services and things like that. She has kind of pivoted and she has a lot of business coaching. I literally still work with her to this day, but she was like very into branding and all that stuff early on. And so she came upon me and then it was just like so perfect because I wasn't really thinking about it honestly. I was consistently thinking about branding, but I was not really thinking about somebody to help me in that space. And so it was just so beneficial and I didn't really have to look for her. And now so often people are struggling with branding. I will recommend that to them because I just remember during that accelerator kind of continuing to flow through, like, who are who are we? Who are we just thinking about it? And like, I knew it, but I couldn't turn it down. And I just did a few sessions with her and it was just like me rambling about who we were and all this stuff for like thirty minutes. And then she's like, OK, cool. Like this is who you are. And it just cleaned it up and made expanding the brand or tweaking it so much easier from that point forward and just like so crucial. But yeah, very grateful for it. I think it definitely made a difference when it came to how we talked to our customers and how we kind of marketed and stuff like that.
Speaker1: Mm. Yeah. That's so interesting. And I think it's like it's great when you can meet those kind of people who you can tell them all the thoughts and they'll just like whip it up into a nice little package for you and be like this is the concise version of what you're saying. And he has it back. So you understand it really clearly yourself. I love that. Yeah.
Speaker2: The most amazing people, because I feel more often than not, I'm kind of just like, am I clear like this? This makes sense. I feel like I'm trying to explain stuff and so I can just like wrap it up in the Bozo's helpful. Totally.
Speaker1: I feel like you're speaking my language. That's like something that I really struggle with as well. When someone asked me the direct question around certain things, I can be like, of course I know it. Like inherently I know it, but I don't know, like that quick one line kind of thing. So interesting. Yeah. I want to dig a bit further into the marketing side of things. I'd love to talk about marketing on the show, especially in those early days when you are really trying to figure out what's working. I know you mentioned influencer marketing. You obviously mentioned the YouTube thing. What were the kinds of. Key drivers for growth in the beginning, more specifically.
Speaker2: Yeah, so the YouTube thing, I think, influenced us in terms of like influencers and what that meant really for the first year, year and a half. All I did was focusing on Instagram and gifted influencers. And that's all I focused on. I tried stuff with Facebook ads. I didn't know what I was doing. It just very easy to dump money there. And when you're bootstrapped and you're not making a lot of money, even five bucks a day is like if I keep doing this. And so it was just like super risky. And I know. And I was like, I'm going to pull back a little bit more about what I'm doing. So, yeah, we literally just consistently posted on social. We would do some partnerships with brands. I don't think we did a ton, but we would try to do like bundles or clubs or things like that with other brands. I would try to reach out with brands and influencers. I always tell people, like my partnerships were always a little bit bigger than where we were just to increase the likelihood of working together. Still have that increased reach. Five thousand followers, maybe that's seven to ten thousand dollar range as far as brands or influencers. I was reaching out to I wasn't going after people with 50 hundred five thousand dollars just because there was less likelihood that they're even going to respond to me.
Speaker2: And then also there's less likelihood they're not going to do a gifted post. They're going to need to get paid and they're much less likely to just draw your product if you're like, who is this brand? And so that was pretty much all I focused on. And I would say, you know, I remember kind of like starting with a handful of influencers, and then I remember having a list like I'm going to send out 10 packages this month and sent up 15 this month and just like slowly scaling that up because it was working for us and it did a good job of getting us a point where we were more consistent. I'll say I think the first month I made money, I think we made like seventeen hundred bucks online. And then I think probably in that first year, year and a half, we probably got to see like eight or ten thousand a month in revenue was kind of like where we were sitting at and that was all just like gifted influencers and keep in chugging on Instagram. We didn't have these Twitter, we didn't use Pinterest, we didn't do anything. I think I had like maybe just got started with, like, retargeting Facebook ads for Zeppelin. No YouTube influencers. Yeah, that was kind of like all we focused on.
Speaker1: Just to backtrack one second, when you say the bundling and doing partnerships with other brands, do you just mean like putting co branded stuff online or them just being like, hey, we'll do a package that you can buy with their products in your products online?
Speaker2: Yeah, so a few things, I mean, one, I believe it was within that first year, a year and a half was kind of like a physical bundle. So they sent me a bunch of their products and we put together like one of our serum's and one of their face scrubs and like sold those as a kit. I would do giveaways with brands. It was a little bit later on. But something that ended up doing pretty well for us, too, was always with influencers, but only on their page, like we weren't running giveaways all the time. But like we would have people running giveaways on their page all the time just to increase our reach and our following. And so that was something that did well for us. But yeah, for bundles, kind of like giveaways or a physical package together with another brand name.
Speaker1: Got it. Cool. So interesting. And so if we think about obviously that's a few years in the mix here. But if we just think like big picture, what were the kind of quantum leaps that you were able to make when it comes to marketing and really accelerating that growth and becoming that snowball effect?
Speaker2: Yeah, I think that really honing in on the influencers and getting to a place where it's like, I understand who's going to perform for us. I understand what types of influencers, what types of posts like that was a big thing for us. Getting a handle on Facebook adds that second time around with just retargeting. So if you went to our website, you're going to get hit with an ad and that did well for us. And then the next shift, I would say, was like us able to kind of expand to older audiences. So like look alikes, things like that, like not most people that are familiar with our brand, but we're similar in a way and drive sales off. That was really exciting. That was first time I remember driving sales up like a cold audience on Facebook. I would say those are kind of the biggest shifts that have in marketing. But really our growth, aside from kind of like some of the stuff that happened last year, has been fairly incremental. It hasn't been like we turn this ad on and it was crazy. It's always just been a consistent chug month over month of growth, which is, of course, still exciting. But no one thing that kind of shot everything out.
Speaker1: And I think that's also really key because it's like you've just got to keep persevering. You've got to keep chipping away every single day. And it's those small actions that you continually do. And then over time, you look back and you're like, holy shit, how do we end up here? This is working. This is amazing.
Speaker2: Yeah, exactly. I think the more you hear all the time, but like brands come into a little bit more relevance and it feels like, oh my God, look how they blow up so fast. Or like even sometimes hindsight is 20, like you might be looking back and like you might have known about them a year or two ago and you're like, wow, they're so huge. Now, look what happened. But it's like it's just a consistent child builds on each other. So, you know, like 10 percent, 15 percent, 20 percent growth going from seventeen hundred to two thousand dollars a month is not like a huge shock. But then once you start kind of like making those drugs as you get bigger, it's just more significant. And so just really trying to focus on that consistent growth, which can be hard. I've definitely hit plateaus and I'm learning to get more comfortable with those photos and what that means, because I constant linear growth isn't real or isn't accessible, like it's not going to happen forever. And so getting more comfortable with that. But at the same time, just trying to continue to incrementally improve and grow your brand, I think is going to be the thing that for everybody will say that you just shot up out of nowhere, but you really just been consistently growing the whole time.
Speaker1: Totally. And I also imagine in your case or in some cases, you really focused on Instagram, you totally nailed it. Then you stepped on the ads, you started nailing it. And then I imagine adding in another channel, nailing that, adding it on. And just once you've got it stacked and you've got that full omni channel approach, next thing you know, the wheels are in motion everywhere. And you're seeing that growth.
Speaker2: Yeah. Picture, that's literally exactly how you approach things. And I will say as we grow, we have more resources or we think about capital or things like that, then maybe it opens up the opportunity of like, OK, now we can Twitter and talk or we can do like tick stock and YouTube and you have more available things out. But I'm definitely somebody that I try not to get on a platform or in a different channel or things like that unless we're going to do it all the way, because it's just if you're half in, half out, you have tick tock. You're posting like maybe once a week. You don't really respond to people in there. It's like you might as well not do it myself. But all that energy into Instagram or Twitter or whatever you are using. And so I'm very big. I'm like, if I am going to go on a platform, I need to go in it with the full ability to test and figure out what works for us there. And so, of course, if you're smaller or so growing, you have limited time and resources to be able to do that. And so it might make your testing stretched out a little bit more. But I think you just kind of like getting good at something like sweet. We know what works on this room. We know how to, like, just kind of chug that and let it go. Let's figure out how we can start testing somewhere else or whatever.
Speaker1: Are you guys doing anything on Ticktock or clubhouse or any other new platform that I haven't heard of yet?
Speaker2: We want to get in on tech talk. I mean. I think it's just interesting because I feel like I definitely used take off personally and it's like it's not like this super committee where I still feel like there's so much opportunity there, like it still feels new in the terms of, like, you can still pretty much grow a lot on there. And so we want to get into that. The same thing, though, just making sure the resource line, like who's doing the content, who's doing all this to make sure we have everything aligned consistently post on there and keep up with everything. Clubhouse a little bit. I did my first clubhouse talk the other day. We haven't really done anything as a brand on there. And I personally debate going back and forth how how deep I want to be on their phone. I like another platform into my mix, how much I want to kind of hop on there and all that stuff. But it's there and it's something I've been thinking about, but not too deeply.
Speaker1: And I feel the same with clubhouse. It's like I love to dabble in it, but then I'm like, oh gosh, can I add another thing when I'm trying to do all the other things as it is kind of the vibe of overwhelm from all forms? Totally. I get it. A lot of beauty brands that I've spoken to so far have gone down that VC money route and from what I could see online, you haven't done that today. How are you managing the hurdle that most seem to bump into when it comes to McHugh's large queues scaling into retailers and that kind of the cash flow element?
Speaker2: Yeah, so we haven't taken any equity or money or anything in that sense, we have done some stuff, I will say, with Clear Bank, PayPal, working capital, know a lot of online, only kind of like loan or I guess line of credit would be maybe a better term, which are super easy, super straightforward. You just sink your shop, find they're like, cool, you make this much, you're eligible for this much. I will say as we grow and we have more access to other capital, it's not like the best thing definitely hurts the cash a little bit more as opposed like a more traditional form of debt. So those are some things that have come in. And then I think also just understanding our cash a lot more. I really probably didn't understand our cash flow very well until like midway through last year, I got to a place where we were scaling and we were growing like, man, we're making like much more money. I think April at the ivankovich started, it was like we immediately kind of like doubled our revenue from March to April. And I just remember, like, it feels like it still feels as every single week as it did in March, as it did in February. And it was like we were consistently making more and more money. But it was like that I feel like I'm relying on how much I'm going to do in sales today, tomorrow or whatever to make sure I can pay for stuff today and tomorrow. And so it was just like accurately understanding that cash flow. And so that was huge for me to really understand our cash flow. A lot more to understand if I was looking at the next three months, I should pretty much note the bank account was going to look like over the next three months, and that was something I just never had the foresight to do or really understand.
Speaker2: So that was very crucial. I think I also could have probably done a lot more earlier on if I had understood that because I spent the first two, two and a half years of our business scaling, making more money, but still playing it pretty tight because I just didn't understand how to manage the cash flow properly. So I think with that, I think with some of these kind of like a little bit more accessible debt platforms, we've been able to kind of swing it and make it happen. And as a bootstrap brand that came from a very small bootstrap I was making, I think our early credit card was like twelve hundred bucks. If I had a couple of hundred each month for my own babysitting money, I'd put it in like come from very small, scrappy beginnings. I try to stretch my dollars, especially I can into the point earlier. If I don't have the luxury of testing out, like let's test out these Facebook guys and if they don't work well, we learned that this didn't work or let's test out to talk. And if it works, it goes crazy. But if it doesn't work, well, it's like I don't have that luxury because I'm just on a tightrope of, like, we got this much capital and if I can't make this capital make money, then it's going to be hard. So it definitely is a much tighter rope to walk.
Speaker2: It's been great for me to just really learn a lot about the business and be super scrappy and also, of course, get to a point where, like I have if I do raise money, I have a better valuation or I have so much more experience because like, OK, like look at the point we've grown to. I still have all the equity and there's a lot of great things in there. But looking forward and thinking about now, I think I've proven to myself or to others, if I do raise money of like obviously I know how to run in scale. The business scaling to another level definitely is a different story and figuring out where I fit in in that journey. But the pace of growth is really and I think ideally when you raise money, that's what a lot of folks want to kind of put money in. But yeah, I would say just kind of like some of those that like loan lending platforms and again, the ones that were super accessible because I didn't know anything about finance, I had to go to a banker. I knew how to get a bank, how to approach them and try to get a loan. And what I should prepare, like I didn't know how to do any of that stuff. And so it was just this is obviously a click of a button with some of those other platforms, like Clear Bank or Shopify or whatever. And so I leaned on that and really understanding my cash flow. And I think that has really opened up a lot of opportunities for us.
Speaker1: And it also sounds like having that mentality and being in that situation just forces you to be super lame and continually remain lean. And if you do raise money in the future, you'll be able to have that leanness to your approach.
Speaker2: Yeah, you definitely are super, super scrappy and figuring out like you want to make your dollar stretch. And of course, it's definitely a mindset. There's a ton of founders who will raise money early on and still have that mindset. But if you launch and you have two million in the bank, you're probably a little bit more free than somebody who is. I started with fifty in the bank and then eventually they raised two million. And it's just a different mindset. And I also just think there's so much to learn. Some people are just so well equipped and so experienced and all this stuff. But I think back to even if somebody gave me one hundred thousand in the first year that I ran it, I would have probably run through that money, like I just didn't know what I was doing. So it's like just to have this now of like I know what to do, like I know exactly what to do with this capital, and of course, I'm sure I'll look back on this like five years. And I just know so much more and I feel so much more confident in the decisions that I would make with capital. And the thought of somebody handing me over that much money early on scares me because there was a lot of me just like figuring stuff out. I think a lot of people take that path and some figure it out and some I'm learning it on my own was definitely beneficial. And I am very grateful to have kind of done it that way.
Speaker1: Absolutely. It sounds like it's been the right pathway for sure. I have a specific beauty industry question for you that came from one of my female startup club listeners. She's a business owner and she was wanting to know how beauty brands typically approach pricing their products and whether there's like a formula or a blueprint for that.
Speaker2: Yeah, so for me, I try to aim for like a seventy seventy five percent margin on my products and so that might give a little bit when you go into wholesale, but you can bring in other things like the scale. It gets cheaper when you make more products. But if you want to do wholesale, maybe you want to do this forever and never sell in retailers or stuff like that. You're selling in retailers off the bat. They're taking half at least. And so if I have a product at 20 bucks, that means the retailer is going to pay us ten bucks for it. I need to make sure that I'm making money on that. Ten dollars. And so you want to have a good margin there. And so when you're taking your costs, what are the ingredient costs or the packaging costs? The labor costs, you know, like everything that goes into making that product, how much does it cost to make and making sure you're getting a good margin on that wholesale costs and of course, on the cost to see, of course, you make that full 20 bucks, but then you have different fulfillment. You're paying more per product to fulfill because it's being shipped out for a package you might have like a cool Maila or stickers or all these other things that kind of go into the versus wholesale.
Speaker2: So there's just some different costs that come in at different angles. But I would say just you got to make sure you're making money off of that. And I would say also, though, keeping in mind, depending on how small you are, you can look at what cost are going to look like down the road to see if you're going to hit economies of scale. So you might have like a horrible margin right now because it's like I make one product at a time, and if you're making twenty products at a time, it costs a lot of money to make those because it's probably just so much more expensive to get those ingredients. But you might say, OK, if I start ordering 50 pounds of clay or if I start ordering five hundred pounds of clay at a time, then it goes from being 20 cents an ounce to two cents an ounce. So it's like, yeah, my margins might suck right now, but down the road I'm going to be super solid. Don't go too far because you don't want to be, like, not making any money for too long. I would say I don't know, maybe like when you're kind of like pushing like five hundred a thousand units, you should be at a place where you have pretty solid margins and it should only improve from there.
Speaker2: And then the last thing I'll say is just kind of look at like who's your competition and what's your pricing look like there? Do you want to be luxury? Do you want to be like super max? You want to be? Of course, there's this area like mass shows just kind of where we fall, who are your competitors? And if you want to hire them competitively or lower than them, and if you're going for like a super affordable price point, like the lower your price and gets, I think the less creative you have to be with formulas. Of course, if your performance are a little bit more engaging or just more expensive to make or things like that, you're going to price higher and it makes sense. But if you're kind of like the cheapest massac, I want to be so easy on people. It's like three bucks and it's like your grade is probably aren't going to be there. Your packaging is going to be super basic or whatever. But just figuring out where you fall as far as competitors and stuff like that goes to mom.
Speaker1: That's awesome. Thank you so much for that insight. I love that. Where is the business today and what does the future look like?
Speaker2: Yeah, so today we are focusing on scale online and then really just trying to build out like a true omni channel brand. Like I mentioned, some of the early stages for us really looked like me going in the target and looking at the Acme space. And so we are currently carried with Target online and carried in like a little over two hundred fifty locations in the States. And so really just trying to continue to perform in those stores and scale to more stores within Target. And looking into what does retail expansion look like for us as a mass market brand. A little bit higher price point masti is, you know, is it kind of an old to play or something like that? As we think about next year? Are we thinking about places like Rite Aid or Walmart? What does that mean for our supply chain and pricing and all that stuff? So that's kind of like where my head spun out right now, continuing to, of course, drive and push growth. I think that I've definitely grown like a solid pace, but I've been very fortunate that from the time that I launched, which was like twenty seventeen to now or maybe a year ago, there hasn't been a ton of players within the Afghan space. There was Korologos who was just like inherently very different from us. But I think we are seeing a lot of players kind of like enter that space is becoming a lot more exciting to talk about and help treat breakouts, something that retailers are excited about and something that I see new brands kind of entering the space regularly. So now I'm ready to pick up the pace on how we grow and really enter the space in a big way and be a leader in the space and just not fall behind. That's my big goal right now, is just making sure we're leading this new wave of mass and keeping up with all the other folks who have raised a ton of money and making sure we're keeping pace with them.
Speaker1: Yeah, amazing kicking those goals, keeping that ball moving. What advice do you have for women who have a big idea and want to start their own business?
Speaker2: I'd say just go for it. I think that for most people, it's just upside. When I launched, I, of course didn't have a family or like a lot of payments, just rent or anything like that. But it was also just like I also wasn't making any money. Also, I'd like to try and do stuff like that on the side to make sure I could sustain myself. And so I just think there's nothing but upside. And I think really the biggest thing, if you have this great novel idea or whatever it is, make sure you're very clear on your differentiation. Why you. It's a hard question and I think people get sometimes upset by it or things like that. But if I'm looking at the competitors and I'm looking at you, why do I care about you? Getting people to change over is a big thing to do. And so I think a lot of times people don't think through that. I think it's a cool idea. They don't think about the effort it's going to take for people to shop them instead of somebody else. So really think about that and really challenge the self and ask yourself why anybody should care about you or what you're doing. And then I think just being focused really try to focus and understand where growth is coming from, where customers are coming from, what you can do to improve and just replicate that and do it over and over and over and do that to scale. I think the less focused you are and the more broad based you are, it's going to feel like you're doing stuff, but you're really just doing busy work and you're not moving yourself forward at all. And so I would say if you do jump into it, just really understand why people should choose you and really understand why you're growing or why you're improving. And if you're not, how to improve and try to ask other people how you can improve and always try to bring that feedback in. And I think we all love it.
Speaker1: That's awesome. Thank you so much. OK, we are up to the six quick questions, part of the episode. Some of it we might have covid, but I always ask the same questions at the end. So question number one is what's your why why do you do what you do?
Speaker2: I think my wife is just folks like me, people who grew up hating their skin and looking in the mirror and, like, literally crying. I think that that's my way of just seeing the impact that I can have on individuals. Of course, it's easy for me to get caught up in, like Scrollbar X amount. Let's hit this many sales and stuff like that. But then there's times where I really get to connect with individuals who use drugs and who are impacted by Rozin and just seeing those individual stories and seeing so many parallels in my early journey with skin care and acne, that's definitely kind of like what keeps you inspired and why I do all of this and why I want to continue to grow it is amazing.
Speaker1: Question number two is what's been the number one marketing moment that's made the business pop?
Speaker2: I would say definitely. I think just everything that happened last year with Black Lives Matter, that was kind of like the first big pop in sales and just like a lot of exposure and everything almost overnight. And so that's definitely kind of the biggest thing.
Speaker1: I'm amazing. Question number three is where do you hang out to get smarter? What are you reading or listening to or subscribing to these days?
Speaker2: Yeah, I mean, I think I get smarter as I talk to other founders and as I connect with other people within the space. I think that's where I would improve, whether it's mentors or whether it's people within the same space as I am. I try to spend a lot of my free time outside of the business sort of puzzles or whatever, stuff like that. And so I would say just kind of connecting with other founders makes me smarter and better and more well equipped for handling Rozin for sure.
Speaker1: I love a good puzzle. Question of a full is how do you win the day? What are your AMPM rituals that keep you feeling happy and successful and motivated?
Speaker2: Yeah, I think morning I definitely is getting up when I need to and then I'll go through, make coffee, drinks and juice and probiotics and kind of like my skincare routine. That's kind of like my flow. And I like to get up early so that I can get started at a reasonable time because I do like a nice kind of like morning. And so I found that I would take that morning no matter what. If I wake up late, that just means my workday is going to start later. And so I think that kind of sets me up for a really nice pace. And then one thing that's really nice is I just started going to coworking space and they closed at five thirty, I think. And it's just like a great start to my day. I have a tendency like I can easily just keep going and going, like once I focus and I'm like in on it. So that has been just like really good. All right. I stop and then I go to the gym and then I'll come home and just like a nice kind of like simmer down from working because I can get so focused. It feels like very tense sometimes for no reason. It's not a topic that like influencer marketing, but I'm just like so in the zone. So having that stop and slow down is definitely helpful for me.
Speaker1: I'm totally with you on the slow mornings. I really cherish a nice morning that's cozy and getting me started in a way that's not bombarded with marketing and advertising and text messages and emails and all of that can. You in the face really quickly.
Speaker2: No, exactly.
Speaker1: Question number five is if you only had a thousand dollars left in the business bank account, where would you spend it?
Speaker2: Yeah, trick question. I think I wouldn't spend it if I only had a thousand dollars left, but if I needed to spend it, if I didn't have product, obviously that's the first place that it goes inventory. But then if it's a bad product, I'd probably put it in Facebook ads.
Speaker1: A good one and last question, question number six is how do you deal with failure? What's your mindset and approach?
Speaker2: Yeah, for me, just figure out how we can get better. I'm not a super emotional person or fluctuate or if something goes wrong, I'm like, cool, sweet. Let's figure out how we can improve it. Like, why did it happen? And let's figure out how we can make it not happen the next time there's some quote. I don't know who said it or whatever, but it's like one of the secrets to happiness is accepting things for what it is instead of what you think it should be. And so that's something that's helped me a lot. Like if something goes wrong, it's like, well, I thought it should go on like this, but it didn't. It is what it is. This is exactly what it is. So let's figure it out from here. So that's kind of like my mindset when something goes wrong or there's a failure, I guess.
Speaker1: Love it. Love it. Jamaica, thank you so much for taking the time to come on Female Startup Club today and share your journey and all the things I have loved chatting with you and I just love your brand. I think it's so fun and very, very cool. I'm excited to see what's coming next for you.
Speaker2: Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. I'm grateful you reached out and that there are folks who are interested in my journey and what was going on at Rozin and hopefully this was cool and helpful or whatever to some both. And my personal Instagram is always open. If people have questions, more specific things, they want to chat with me. I'm always hopping on calls with people just to try to help them out. I definitely think it's worthwhile kind of spreading that knowledge or making anything more accessible. So I appreciate it and I'm glad for sure.
Speaker1: I'm going to link your your Instagram in the show notes for anyone who wants to slide into your DM.
Speaker2: Thank you for your good.